Fuel price increase

[Hellraiser]

er...dunno about you bro, but i stay in selangor and i do get free water....

 

[Spaceman]

Well guys, lets all face it. It aint gonna change. Just look at how the heck happened in Ipoh, where is PKR now? They're too strong, in monetary term. This is how they can rule for 50 yrs.

 

[loafer]

and I don't really think, a change of gvt would do us any good. Just take selangor for exmple. after all the sweet promises they gave us for the 2008 election, none of it has been done yet.

Where's the free water they promised. Where's the study allowance for EVERY 'Anak Selangor'. What I see is, more profit making made by them by destroying the paya indah wetlands.

Wealth are meant to be shared, not to be kept alone.This goes regardless to the opposition or to the ruling party.

Free water only applies to landed properties I believe.

 

[loafer]

Yup it's their job and they've done excellent job at that in developing the country. Like i said before we have one of the world's biggest middle income population in the world and that speaks volume of the government :top: Is there room for improvements??? Of course!!! but do give credit where it's due. You talk as if we're a 3rd world country lol You sure make me laugh bro lol

Yup, one of the biggest middle income country in the world. For sure. And again I think you failed to realize that this middle income group is, well, stuck in the middle income segment? Just how long do you think the middle income group can remain a middle income group with the high cost of living and high inflation rate? At the rate things are going, the middle income group will soon be pushed to the lower income group.

Well at least I've known for a while which party you support hence why you're so protective of them. But anyway you're right, the vote is mine and it's my right who I want to vote for. So you keep voting for the party you love so much, and you'll keep seeing your tax dollars being pocketed by fat little cronies. Being disillusioned and ignorant about real issues isn't an excuse.

 

[loafer]

Here's some reading materials for you Beemer. Hopefully it will shed some light on some of the issues you seem to have no idea about.

http://www.themicahmandate.org/2010/07/it-is-getting-too-expensive-to-live-in-malaysia/

http://anilnetto.com/malaysian-financebusiness/biggest-mega-project-rm43b-mrt-proposal/

Cheers.

 

[buzzlie]

Hmmm with the current big hoohaa about illegal sand mining ... somebody really knew well when to slot in this fuel increase. People are just terkejut on the first few days, then they are back to the sand issue. The power of media ...

 

[buzzlie]

Ron97 retails at 2.10, so not that bad.

Bro, dont get fooled by this rate. First increase maa, if they increase 50 sen, the whole Msia will be standing in front of the Parliament the next day. Lets see in few months to come ...

 

[Hellraiser]

erection...er...i mean election cumming mah, so the gomen are 'behaving' themselves. i bet my bottom dollar...er...ringgit.... fuel prices are gonna go sky high after that.

 

[Hellraiser]

Yup it's their job and they've done excellent job at that in developing the country. Like i said before we have one of the world's biggest middle income population in the world and that speaks volume of the government :top: Is there room for improvements??? Of course!!! but do give credit where it's due. You talk as if we're a 3rd world country lol You sure make me laugh bro lol

bro, do you have facts/reports to justify all your comments?

i prefer to read the facts and decide for myself. not impressed with comments that do not have hard facts. anyone can say anything these days but let the facts talk for themselves.

i would appreciate the following facts :

1. malaysia being the worlds biggest income population in the world
2. malaysia being first world country as opposed to being third world
3. malaysia fdi's as compared to indonesia/singapore/thailand and vietnam (2008/2009/2010)
4. foreign companies (intel/freescale) investment in malaysia as compared to investment they have in china. automotive industry as compared to thailand. is investment in malaysia bigger? if not so, why?
5. hard facts - standard and cost of living - M'sia and the rest of the countries in this region
6. status of the rule of law and the separation of powers in this country
7. status of students getting schorlarships in this country, by race
8. status of professionals migrating to other countries, reasons why.
9. status of 'malaysia-my-second-home' project and the time it takes to approve
10. malaysia's short term and long term goals for the next 10 to 20 years. 50-100 years.

i look forwards to receiving a favourable response to justify your comments. nothing personal, its just facts.

 

[loafer]

Beemer,

http://www.ubs.com/1/e/wealthmanagement/wealth_management_research/prices_earnings.html

Download the Price and Earning 2009 PDF and go through it. You'll be surprised at what you'll find.

 

[B33mEr]

bro, do you have facts/reports to justify all your comments?

i prefer to read the facts and decide for myself. not impressed with comments that do not have hard facts. anyone can say anything these days but let the facts talk for themselves.

i would appreciate the following facts :

1. malaysia being the worlds biggest income population in the world
Never did i say the biggest but rather one of the biggest in the world ... Anyways here's link for your reading pleasure ...
https://docs.google.com/viewer?url=http://www.adb.org/Documents/Fact_Sheets/MAL.pdf

https://docs.google.com/viewer?url=http://www.pwc.com/en_GX/gx/retail-consumer/pdf/malaysia.pdf
According to PWC we have about 50% of the population that is in the middle income bracket
I do hope thats enough facts for you

2. malaysia being first world country as opposed to being third world
Again never did i say Malaysia being a 1st world country but rather a developing country do take time to read bro

3. malaysia fdi's as compared to indonesia/singapore/thailand and vietnam (2008/2009/2010)
I've posted a link in one of Albundy's interesting threads - Do a search on Albundy's threads pls
Anyway here's a few link that you can compare between Malaysia, Thailand and Vietnam (one of the highest inflows of FDI might i add - comparatively of course)

4. foreign companies (intel/freescale) investment in malaysia as compared to investment they have in china. automotive industry as compared to thailand. is investment in malaysia bigger? if not so, why?
Our FDI is indeed bigger than Thailand (historically and in recent times) ... For China ... aiyoh bro do you really need to ask??? China with a population of 1.2 Billion who in their right mind wouldn't wanty to invest in China???

5. hard facts - standard and cost of living - M'sia and the rest of the countries in this region
Indeed to get the facts for it do refer to Loafer's link - It seems that buying food, clothes and electronics goods are cheaper in Malaysia than Singapore

6. status of the rule of law and the separation of powers in this country.
Too deep for me larr bro

7. status of students getting schorlarships in this country, by race
Sorry bro but am not touching that subject. It might lead to something else more explosive which i do not want to instigate. Suffice to say that education should be for all and should be on merit. Those that are deprived should be assisted by the government.

8. status of professionals migrating to other countries, reasons why.
That's pretty easy bro ... promise of better pay, education, health care services and etc in a country such as UK, US, New Zealand and so on ... I've never heard people migrating to China, India, Indonesia, Thailand, Afrika (except for South Afrika that is cos there's a lot of rare BMW's in that country ) and etc for that matter.

9. status of 'malaysia-my-second-home' project and the time it takes to approve.
Not sure about that as I don't take a healthy interest in that program but suffice to say that UK too have that program but more in attracting investment and etc ... e.g. if you have GBP100k you coukld easily get a biz visa, which after a 5 year period it can be converted to PR statuts, approves by the IND

10. malaysia's short term and long term goals for the next 10 to 20 years. 50-100 years.
Whoa ... I don't have that sort of privy information. But I do foresee that labour and resources will be more expensive in Malaysia and a knowledge based economy is vital to our growth as a nation in the future.

i look forwards to receiving a favourable response to justify your comments. nothing personal, its just facts.

Bro do take the time too read on previous post in this thread there are links that i've posted that could easily back up some of the question you asked ... I've always tried to back my findings with facts. Anyway my answer in blue.

 

[B33mEr]

Beemer,

http://www.ubs.com/1/e/wealthmanagement/wealth_management_research/prices_earnings.html

Download the Price and Earning 2009 PDF and go through it. You'll be surprised at what you'll find.

I am surpised indeed bro :top: It seems that food and rentals is cheaper in Kuala lumpur than Jakarta
and in Bangkok people are putting in more hours than you would working in Kuala Lumpur (2165 vs 2050 hours) but our counterparts in Indonesia is worse with 2172 working hours with even less annual leave ... wow we sure have it easy compared to both countries ... Hence why we should even be more grateful

Thanks very much for the link :top: ... To complement your findings do take the time to read the findings from PWC :
https://docs.google.com/viewer?url=http://www.pwc.com/en_GX/gx/retail-consumer/pdf/malaysia.pdf

 

[Hellraiser]

Bro do take the time too read on previous post in this thread there are links that i've posted that could easily back up some of the question you asked ... I've always tried to back my findings with facts. Anyway my answer in blue.

thanks for your response and your efforts in highlightening the good work that our government is doing.

all said and done, i still feel there is more that our government can do. let's not compare if other governments are also filled with corruption, nepotism and all things negative. we should set an example for the world for a clean and transparent government.

other governments are also accountable and it is not surprising to see whole governments or individual ministers resign over even a small fiasco. this is something i don't see here which leaves me to think that our government is accountable but not responsible. again, this could be the culture of our local politics which can tranlate also to being minister for life.

again, as a malaysian citizen, it is my wish to see malaysia a country run by the book. enough of lawatan sambil belajar...enough of bailouts...enough of PKZ scandals (surprised no one mentioned this)....enough of proton having several layers of cronism and inflating the cost of spares and the car....enough of hiring consultants which cost a bomb and the rakyat's money....enough of money politics....

lemme share some facts, imports related to GLC's and government projects must go via local MTO's (multi modal transport operators) who do not have the international network and similar to business atas angin. here, the international forwarder imports on behalf and the local MTO bills the government 100-200% (sometimes more) than the actual cost. MTO's were initially created to cut cost but the above is far from it. who losses in the end...taxpayers in my opinion.

as a malaysian, i would like to see more accountability and not just lip service. as a country with much resources, the benefits should be channeled more evenly to the rakyat and not to individual group pockets.

i am not happy with the current scenario because i sincerely think malaysia can do much better. maybe my expectations are high and i don't think there is anything wrong with having high expectations of our government.

and yes, cost of living in indonesia is higher. this is what happens where there is much corruption where the cost is later passed on to the rakyat. not sure about the rental bit but similar to the phillipines, indonesians pay yearly rentals in advance, not the monthly we have here.

should you have any enquiries re indonesia, do let me know. cheers!

 

[ALBundy]

Do you see South Korea or Taiwan producing rubber??? I guess not We're moved way past the agricultural economy and into manufacturing tho resources and labour cost is higher in our country it is offset by the higher educated workforce we have as compared to 3rd world countries hence we have INTEL, AMD, MOTOROLA, FREESCALE and other MNC electronics and IT company in Malaysia also do take note that there are plans to move from manufacturing to knowledge based economy ...

Why on earth you're mentioning RM2.70 price during an oil crisis worlwide is beyond me are you aware that at that time the world prices per barrel went as high as USD 140 or more ... Plus it lasted only for 6 month in which the government re-instated the subsidy once the oil prices drop down back to normal. What on earth can, any government for that matter, do with that very short period????

You mentioned R&D ... lol I'm speaking about commercial entity that will find it's competitive advantage through R&D among many other ways to differentiate and to remain competitive not about universities. But however i do recognise and agree that R&D by universities is very important, in areas such as Bio tech, medical, agro farming, material science and many more, towards making Malaysia a knowledge based economy.

And of course the taxi drivers ... what is it that they don't complain about? They complain about everything and yet the government agreed on the revision of taxi rates last year, cheap NGV fuel plus pay 50% on tolls
Also did you know that during the oil crisis in 2008 the government announced fuel subsidy for the taxi driver to help ease their burden??? Why take taxi driver as an example is beyond me.

The main reason why we need to cut down the subsidy lies here:

https://docs.google.com/viewer?url=http://www.lawnet.com.my/lawnetpublic/2010BudgetSpeech.pdf

The government is adamant in improving our standard of living and too do that they need to reduce as much subsidies as they can.

Perhaps I should emulate chedet's style of writing as it will make folks of various levels of comprehension to understand the frustration of most malaysians when it comes to subsidies.

1. There were plans to move to a K-based economy for many years already. It was mooted by then PM, Tun Dr. Mahathir. One of the key areas was in Information Technology and to develop a similar Silicon Valley in Malaysia. Well, look at what CyberJaya is after so many years.

2. Perhaps what the government needs to understand is, the key to moving to a K based economy is to develop the human resource, instead of spending billions on buildings and infrastructure. Look at India's IT industry, its the people that matters!!!

3. The 2.70 oil price was mentioned, as it was relevant to the discussion. Reason being, when the price hike happened, the government promised the $$ saved will be used to improve on Public Transport. As usual, nothing concrete has happened so far even though I was made aware of the proposal being evaluated by the relevant government agencies since then.

4. As for R&D, let's not jump the gun. Not many firms investing in Malaysia are into R&D, even the "big names" you mentioned. Basically all these are manufacturing plants with the R&D being done somewhere else and if the subsidies currently enjoying by them are removed, they will move somewhere else. Even if they do intend to do R&D here, do we have the capacity to do so?

5. In many developed countries, a lot of R&D is done in universities and sponsored by big commercial entities whether in electronics, bio-tech and etc etc. That's how these universities have such large grants for R&D. The subsequent "discovery" or technology derived from these R&D works will be owned by these companies. Again, I reiterate what I said earlier, it's not happening in our local universities.

6. Taxi drivers are mentioned because of the hardship they faced everyday due to rising costs of living. Specifically the ones I mentioned are already working part time in the evening as a taxi driver just to earn an honest living to support their family.

7. Removing subsidies will NOT help this country to escape the middle income trap, more so given the many "ifs" and "assumptions" that money saved will be put into good use.

8. More so that is if there is any more left after all the expenditures incurred. Please take note only 10% of the population pay income tax, and 40% of the government's expenditure comes from oil and gas revenue.

9. What needs to be done is a change of government policies that will make this country conducive and attractive to investors, and there is plenty to be done to develop our people so that there is big pool of talented people that can meet the needs of a K based economy.

Cheers
Albundy

 

[Maniac]

All, here's my 2 cents worth on taxes & the cost of living in m'sia:

I would like my taxes to be used efficiently and wisely, for the development of the country. I'm happy to support the civil services with my taxes, provided we get quality & efficiency in return. My opinion is that the current govt is probably on the painful but necessary right track with the subsidy cuts, but there's still much room for improvement, esp with what's done with the "savings". No more lining of pockets. If we can get a step change in performance through voting in of new blood, then I am for it. Observations of state govts that have changed hands recently reveal mixed results - but generally for the better, though slower than many would have desired after 2 years. Is it because we still have much of the same systems in place? I'm reminded of the 70's series "yes minister" where the premise was that ministers think they are in charge, but the people who run the country are really the civil servants... Incidentally, M'sia has the highest proportion of civil servants against the size of its population.
I would like to live in a country where my family and I can feel safe & secure, where I can trust the police to be vigilant and protect public law and order. I do not want to be on the constant lookout for snatch thieves, home break-ins, car jackings, muggings at ATMs (all of which I or some member of my relatives / friends have already experienced). Because of this, many of us spend our hard earned incomes to pay for security - secure housing areas, gated communities, home alarms, security film tints for our cars, to name a few...which is a reduction in disposable income, and a higher cost of living.
We also pay quite a bit for clean water, don't you think? How many of us do NOT have water filters installed in our homes? I suggest that not many. We invest in the region of a thousand bucks as a minimum to install filtration systems, and some pay for maintenance on a monthly basis. Are we ever going to get water that we can drink from the taps? If anything, water quality has worsened over the years, esp in the mature housing areas.

On a separate thought - in the next GE's, I wish that we could vote for the PERSON on the ballot sheet, and not just the party symbol. That way, we can truly evaluate the candidate - his/her integrity & commitment to the rakyat, his/her ability to deliver on promises and his/her character. Even though there is hopping (something I detest), the elected rep is still the person who represents us. I want an elected rep and a government that is interested in doing its best for the country and for the rakyat. I'm willing to "pay" to get this type of government with my tax ringgit. Kind of like what us enthusiast are willing to do with our UDMs - pay for quality!

Am I being too idealistic?

 

[B33mEr]

Perhaps I should emulate chedet's style of writing as it will make folks of various levels of comprehension to understand the frustration of most malaysians when it comes to subsidies.

1. There were plans to move to a K-based economy for many years already. It was mooted by then PM, Tun Dr. Mahathir. One of the key areas was in Information Technology and to develop a similar Silicon Valley in Malaysia. Well, look at what CyberJaya is after so many years.

Cyberjaya is part of an initiative to develop the K economy ... Just go to MDEC web site you'll see a few hundred if not thousands of MSC status companies ... We are churning out more IT talents and more IT related products and services

2. Perhaps what the government needs to understand is, the key to moving to a K based economy is to develop the human resource, instead of spending billions on buildings and infrastructure. Look at India's IT industry, its the people that matters!!!

Yes i agree it's the people that matters that's why we are producing more grads than ever before.

3. The 2.70 oil price was mentioned, as it was relevant to the discussion. Reason being, when the price hike happened, the government promised the $$ saved will be used to improve on Public Transport. As usual, nothing concrete has happened so far even though I was made aware of the proposal being evaluated by the relevant government agencies since then.

No it was not relevant at all ... It was at a time where world oil prices ballooned sky high because of speculators when the threat of a recession did the price went down. The government re-instated the subsidy once the oil prices went back to normal levels within 6 months. What can the government do within such a short period of time? You're just trying to find faults really.

4. As for R&D, let's not jump the gun. Not many firms investing in Malaysia are into R&D, even the "big names" you mentioned. Basically all these are manufacturing plants with the R&D being done somewhere else and if the subsidies currently enjoying by them are removed, they will move somewhere else. Even if they do intend to do R&D here, do we have the capacity to do so?

LOL ... again please re-read and comprehend my post earlier as i said that companies needing to survive will find their competitive edge through R&D in improving their existing products or new product/services lineup amongst others. I am talking about companies streamlining, increasing efficiency, extending PLC through implementing processes, R&D of processes and methodologies and etc in the face of rising cost and competition.

5. In many developed countries, a lot of R&D is done in universities and sponsored by big commercial entities whether in electronics, bio-tech and etc etc. That's how these universities have such large grants for R&D. The subsequent "discovery" or technology derived from these R&D works will be owned by these companies. Again, I reiterate what I said earlier, it's not happening in our local universities.

Please see my response above.

6. Taxi drivers are mentioned because of the hardship they faced everyday due to rising costs of living. Specifically the ones I mentioned are already working part time in the evening as a taxi driver just to earn an honest living to support their family.

It depends on their work rate really .. average income of taxi drivers varies from RM1200 to RM 1800 after paying the daily rentals .. It would be naive to think that as taxi drivers they're not earning as they should after all there are more taxi's and limo services now than ever before ...


7. Removing subsidies will NOT help this country to escape the middle income trap, more so given the many "ifs" and "assumptions" that money saved will be put into good use.
I'm sorry but are you basing that on facts or are you just assuming?
Our PM have already state there are economic plans underway to increase income for the lower income population ... The government recognise the facts and are working on it.

8. More so that is if there is any more left after all the expenditures incurred. Please take note only 10% of the population pay income tax, and 40% of the government's expenditure comes from oil and gas revenue.

Hence the more reason why subsidy should be eliminated completely so that the subsidy money can be put to better use.

9. What needs to be done is a change of government policies that will make this country conducive and attractive to investors, and there is plenty to be done to develop our people so that there is big pool of talented people that can meet the needs of a K based economy.

Stop short of selling the country to foreigners what do you propose??? What policy change are you talking about? As it is the government have implemented several policies to open up the market like the banking sector, foreign ownership in companies and etc. We can't be opening up the economy so freely at the expense of local companies ... It must be done gradually and carefully!!!
Talking about IT industry there are many programmers that are earning a basic pay of 4-5k with 3-5 years experiences ... Again there are more graduates now in IT, computer science and engineering than ever before.

p/s: Titan Chemical is being bought by a korean company for the sum of RM2.94 Billion Wouldn't that be an FDI???

Cheers
Albundy

Bro, no need to emulate Chedet's style of writing because your writing is simple enough as it is ... tho Tun style of writing as you say is simple and gets the message across but it is also laced with facts and wisdom. He is a great man indeed :top:

 

[B33mEr]

thanks for your response and your efforts in highlightening the good work that our government is doing.

all said and done, i still feel there is more that our government can do. let's not compare if other governments are also filled with corruption, nepotism and all things negative. we should set an example for the world for a clean and transparent government.

other governments are also accountable and it is not surprising to see whole governments or individual ministers resign over even a small fiasco. this is something i don't see here which leaves me to think that our government is accountable but not responsible. again, this could be the culture of our local politics which can tranlate also to being minister for life.

again, as a malaysian citizen, it is my wish to see malaysia a country run by the book. enough of lawatan sambil belajar...enough of bailouts...enough of PKZ scandals (surprised no one mentioned this)....enough of proton having several layers of cronism and inflating the cost of spares and the car....enough of hiring consultants which cost a bomb and the rakyat's money....enough of money politics....

lemme share some facts, imports related to GLC's and government projects must go via local MTO's (multi modal transport operators) who do not have the international network and similar to business atas angin. here, the international forwarder imports on behalf and the local MTO bills the government 100-200% (sometimes more) than the actual cost. MTO's were initially created to cut cost but the above is far from it. who losses in the end...taxpayers in my opinion.

as a malaysian, i would like to see more accountability and not just lip service. as a country with much resources, the benefits should be channeled more evenly to the rakyat and not to individual group pockets.

i am not happy with the current scenario because i sincerely think malaysia can do much better. maybe my expectations are high and i don't think there is anything wrong with having high expectations of our government.

and yes, cost of living in indonesia is higher. this is what happens where there is much corruption where the cost is later passed on to the rakyat. not sure about the rental bit but similar to the phillipines, indonesians pay yearly rentals in advance, not the monthly we have here.

should you have any enquiries re indonesia, do let me know. cheers!

There's nothing wrong with high expectations on the government bro but we do have to be a bit realistic with our expectations and demands.
If we cut our subsidy now that resources can be better utilized.
Plus there would be no more excuses for the government if they fall short of their promises in improving the lives of Malaysians

 

[blackrobe]

Bro, no need to emulate Chedet's style of writing because your writing is simple enough as it is ... tho Tun style of writing as you say is simple and gets the message across but it is also laced with facts and wisdom. He is a great man indeed :top:

Great at getting this whole country in a mess no less...apart from his racist tendencies and support... sad to say we come from the same kampung!!!

 

[ALBundy]

One just need to read Barry Wain's book to get an insider's story of what transpired during the 22 years of mahathirism. Interesting book and finished reading it in 2 days

 

[BlackCat]

After 8 pages and 79 posts, this is all I have to say...

I have yet to meet a politician without a price tag!