What's your advise on being cheated by dealer & BMW Specialist?

[Vincent Hor]

My friends just bought his 1st Beemer a 2001 E39 some 2 months ago. Mileage reading was 89,000kms Problems started to develop after 3 weeks of ownership. Car was idling poorly. (He should have read anxious thread on buying an E36 325i) So he sent the car to a highly reputable BMW specialist in KL. These are the sequence of events at the BMW specialist1. Ask to change plugs - owner said ok (Problem still there)2. Changed ignition coil - owner said ok next (Pro0blem still there)3. ECU problem. Owner said change and they ordered new one costing RM6K+ next (Problem still there)4. Change cylinder head (2nd hand) RM5.5K Workshop told him got hairline crack due to previous overheating. Total bill paid RM19K. Car seem running ok but after 2 weeks the problem came back again. Towed back to the same workshop and this is what happen 1. Workshop now says it's the cylinder block that is warpped and dismantle the whole engine2. After 2 days they showed him a cracked piston3. Fearing of being ripped off he called for my help.4. They now want to charge him for overhaul cost, new piston & piston rings cost minus the top overhaul cost & head gasket Upon closer inspection I noticed that there were already markings on the crank shaft bearings meaning that a previous overhaul had already been done. Upon measuring the piston then the workshop then realised that the pistons were oversized. Now their advise is to get a new piston & new rings. But I told him no to as he could end up with another problem as the other pistons could also give him problem and there will be no end. So they told him to get a second hand block since he already got a second hand cylinder head. I told him no again, because we will not know the condition of the block and besides he will have to pay for head gaskets and bla, bla, bla. To be on the safe side my advise to the owner is to get a 2nd hand engine kosong with warranty. Then sell off cyclinder head that the workshop installed for him. He is proceeding with my recommendation and he has already bought a 2nd hand engine to be installed very soon. However he does not trust the workshop anymore simply because they did not resolve his problem after spending so much money. He doubt very much if indeed he had any problem with his ignition coil, ECU and cylinder head in the first place now that they have discovered that the problem was withone of the piston. This morning he went to the workshop with a tow truck and have since towed the car to another workshop. Obviously the BMW specialist is not too happy and wanted to charged him for work done on openning up the entire engine. Anyway my friend told them to fly kite. Upon further diagnosis we found that the mileage had been tempered. System shows that the actual mileage is 260+ kms. My friend is asking me if he has any recourse against; 1. The dealer for deceiving him on the actual mileage of the car thus misleading him towards making a decision to buy the car in the first place. 2. The Specialist BMW workshop for not being able to diagnose the problem properly thus making him spend / replace the ECU and cylinder head. They probably used a standard cylinder head gasket in the 1st top overhaul instead of oversize head gasket since his pistons were oversized. I know some of our members are experts in such tribunal matters and therefore seek your expertise opinions on how to go about making a claim against the two parties. Thanks in advance.

 

[astroboy]

I'm not a lawyer but from your posting, not all cost is lost:

1. Spark plug, not much money here.
2. Ignition coils, since nothing wrong with the "original", keep them as spare or sell them off to us members who need it to recover some money, rather than "yik" the workshop.
3. Now u have a spare ECU, or sell it off to us members who need it rather than "yik" the workshop.
4. Cylinder head, another usable spare here and most probably the workshop has already targeted another customer to sell it and make some money while u scratching your head.

Normally workshop very smart, they will say they think its the bla..bla..bla.. The moment u say yes, you have just granted consent to complete the "contract", thus liable for the bill. Unless you tell them if it doesn't solve the problem, u not going to pay! Then they more careful or else they just take u for granted.

As for the dealer, they can say they didn't do it. Its sold as is basis and your friend has all the time he needs to inspect, why now only discover? Dealer warranty I suppose over lio... so my unprofessional opinion says your friend is screwed. There is a clause for misleading ads that you might want to invoke but again, this is not my domain.

I dare not buy a used BMW without complete service history, just because of fearing this will happen and what your friend faced is not the worst possible thing. The car can be stolen, without proper custom clearance documents and worth nothing in the resell market while the loan must still be serviced and roadtax revoked by JPJ and car impounded by the Kastam. Trust no one!

Now please share with us which workshop and dealer is this so other members won't fall prey.

 

[IsaacVky]

Now please share with us which workshop and dealer is this so other members won't fall prey.

 

[pussy]

Unker...

'buyer beware' or...(lawyers know the latin word)

i see neither the dealer nor the workshop is at fault...

dealer:

1. they sold the car, hence your friend should have really checked out the car before he bought it.
any happens after the car is driven out the yard/shop, is his problem if the car gets stolen, burned, blah-blah...however, if there is a warranty, then he can claim back to the dealer..
dealer that's adjusts the mileage, is in the wrong, his business of selling, as astroboy said, can be a stolen car also...

so, i feel he got cheated... but can't blame the dealer that he sold a car with a problem. maybe the dealer did not know ?

so, i dun blame the dealer, there is many out there, trust none..

workshop:

usually, the first i start is to identify the cheapest solution first, start with the basic fault finding then to the worst part ie. overhaul the engine...
so now, the workshop did their best, show the problem, your friend confirmed to go ahead with works or if he did not trust them, then towed the car to another workshop.
the head is what the workshop found out, then it was the block, hence also the workshop was dealing with a patient which did not have previous records of the car...
so trial and error... dun blame them, i think other workshops would have done the same thing...

what happened is that i see that 'someone' did a rush hush-hush job on the car, then sold it off..
your worst luck...

just tell your friend that it's lucky to spot it now, learn one or two about buying a secondhand car...

Forrest gump - eating a box of chocolates is you don't know what the inside will taste like...

cheers..

 

[astroboy]

Unker...

'buyer beware' or...(lawyers know the latin word)....

ceteres parabus

Come! we make the car disappear and claim insurance, sounds like a good exit plan yah?! :wink:

Then u will spot the e39 in track days, arriving in a canvased up flatbed.. :wink:

 

[jarance]

First is how can a 2001 clock 85K Km.. why your friend did not check the car in the first place? if you can now find that the car actually clocked 260K Km, why you did did it in the first place. your friend should have check for your advise first.

no point crying over spilled milk. btw, what is the warranty for the car?

 

[blackrobe]

ceteres parabus

Its Caveat emptor brooooooo

 

[jarance]

Its Caveat emptor brooooooo

No lah.. It either Ultra Vibres or Ultra Virus or Ultra Man.. I am confused... :stupid:

 

[ICEMAN 68]

that's the journey everyone learns ....sooner or later ...


the 1st 2 items are ok ...but the 3rd one is where your friend should had seek for a second opinion ....

just my 2 cent ...

 

[Vincent Hor]

Thanks for the advise.

I do think that it was his mistake in the first place. 1st time buying a BMW and such was his experience.

Right, there is no proof that the mileage was adjusted by the dealer as it could be the first owner who adjusted it before selling the car to the dealer.

Like Astroboy suggested, there is still to be salvaged. The ECU (if it is indeed not faulty) and the cylinder head could be sold to needy users.

I have spoken to the owner and he has asked me not to disclose who the dealer or the BMW specialist workshop.

Moral of the story is to do your research and make use of the valuable information available in this forum before embarking on buying a BMW especially for 1st time BMW potential buyers.

All I can say it's an expensive lesson. On the bright side, it's not a stolen car or a joint up car and we can still rectify the problem.

Anyway, the good news is that the owner is still upbeat about the driving pleasure of a BMW when it was not giving him problem.

 

[astroboy]

Its Caveat emptor brooooooo

Now the poster know who's domain is this..

This is what Sun Tzu describe as "throw a brick out to attract a jade" in his Sun Tzu art of war techniques..

Ok, my job is done here.

:9: