Dear Committee...

[Juan Powerblow]

Originally posted by ALBundy@Apr 14 2005, 01:41 AM
Does it prove that I have a bigger private part if I was invited to the Miss Malaysia Beauty Pageant contest? :rofl: :rofl: :yahoo:

Errr, was that directed at me? I do have a bigger PP what! heh!!

 

[ALBundy]

Originally posted by Juan Powerblow+Apr 14 2005, 02:08 AM-->QUOTE (Juan Powerblow @ Apr 14 2005, 02:08 AM)

 

[kevster30]

This thread is beginning to run off topic, can we get back to the matter at hand or this thread will be closed.

Thank You.

 

[ALBundy]

Kevster, this is actually topic related to BUToh's comment on getting invites from certain organisations which to me doesnt really prove anything.

Whether BMW Malaysia send us any invitations for events or launchings is irrelevant to the club. It would be nice but if its not done, its fine with many of us.

And then about the comment Mr. Jipster has made over the last BMW party event at Souled Out. I don't understand why this also has to be made into an issue. As for who actually invited us, to quell all speculation, it was the Event Management Company (hired by BMW Malaysia) who happened to know that some of the BMW car club members were having HH at Souled Out!! Well they actually invited the few guys at HH but we told them we have more than a few members and requested for 100 passes and we later posted on the forum and passed it to those that were interested. Whether BMW Malaysia invited us or not its irrelevant, why we wanna be nitpicking about all these small matters? Can't we MOVE ON!!!

Rgds

 

[fomoco]

shake head shake head....

This is a car club for goodness sake....

grow up la all of you....worst than my 5 year old nephew!

 

[Jipster]

Ok lah..... since i dun wan to be like fomoco's 5 year old nephew....... I CONCEDE ON ALL POINTS....... there is no longer any issue real or perceived...... please accept my humble apologies.

 

[teejay]

Originally posted by Jipster@Apr 13 2005, 08:47 PM


Nice set of wheels there (your sig) .....but 5 lugs mar......u did 5 lug conversion kah?

*off topic*

wheels belong to another forummer.....guess you havent seen mine then.....

Tom likes to take pictures.......ahem.!!...ahem....!!

and modifies them.....

 

[Juan Powerblow]

Originally posted by Jipster@Apr 14 2005, 01:47 AM
Hi Tom,

Nice set of wheels there (your sig) .....but 5 lugs mar......u did 5 lug conversion kah?

I have utmost respect for the Site Administrator/webmaster..... my humble apologies if the following rubs you the wrong way...... its just that I feel compelled to write when ever i feel people have missed the point of an issue raised.....

I know that my incessant postings have irked many of the members here but again my apologies as I feel that these issues, though seemingly transient, are important ones that must be addressed for the future credibility and integrity of the forum/club......

My comments are as follows:

1. Why do you say that U do not get paid for working, whne no one promises U any monies for voluntary work?

I don't get your statement when you're making a statement out of a statement

I think what Mr. Butoh is trying to say is - if your involvement in the club is purely on a voluntary basis, which it should be, one should not at the same time say or even complain "i dont get paid for this u know!"....... it is a commitment that one makes knowing full well what the commitments and obligations are....... the other members should not be made to feel 'guilty' for putting you through the ordeal of being a committee member...

2. Why you dun like to accomodate difficult forumers when knowing full well when you get successful erection, there will be members of various kinds and orientation?

Because it's best to prevent the forum from going down the drain with people with undesired orientations from the start

I think what Mr. Butoh is trying to say is - the forum is on the internet. The nature of the internet is that it is open to the world and open to everyone. You have to expect all sorts of people, good and bad....... perhaps the correct mindset is - knowing full well the possibility of wierdos becoming members, there needs to be some degree of tact and consistency in dealing with the ones that choose to make problems...... remember, not everyone here knows each other..... even if we do, the knowledge may be superficial........ which makes it more important to handle the situation properly.......

3. Y do you keep on saying that this is a "Car Club" without defining the meaning of the car club

-BMWClubmalaysia is a car club. BMWClubmalaysia.com is a forum complimenting the club. It's not dictatorship syndrome but no one is obligated to join and the club or forum is not obligated to entertain undesired questions, requests and comments deemed undesired by the club and forum. As such, don't take the club and forum as the authorities or government of the BMW cult. Because it is not an obligation to the club and forum to house BMW owners or enthusiasts

I am not sure what Mr. Butoh wants to say here. However, here are some thoughts on this.....

Firstly, does registartion on the forum make you a member of the club - if it does, shouldnt it be the other way around to be consistent with the statement  'the forum complements the club'? i.e. you are a club members via some club registration process and the forum is there for your benefit - complements club activities etc.

I am sure no one remembers registering as a club member but knows they have at least registered as a user of the forum which incidentally only complements the club.....

Secondly, on the forum homepage the (apparent) links to the club are not working but the others e.g. the one leading to the forums are.....
Dear Cummittee.....

I suppose a way around this would be to say the forum IS THE CLUB..... but is it? Would that be proper? You see, this may not interest everyone but think about it..... its a fundamental issue..... its what makes the club what it is.....


4. Why izzit one Cummittee mamber can start a thread on Father's aquarium but not non-cummittee on Soiled panties for Japanese export market?

Because a 3year old would know for a fact, that it shouldn't be here

Granted, the postings were going downhill at some point..... but the real point here is WHERE DO YOU DRAW THE LINE? What makes soiled panties worse than 'the use of the word F'? What about the MCP thread or the roadsigns thread or......... sometimes a thread starts innocently enough but descends into pure and utter crap....... hence some here have uttered 'double standards' etc......... a way around this is to have a thought out approach....... a more comprehensive dos and donts list etc. .....how have the other forums handled this etc.....

5, Why BMW Maraysia do not invite you guys to official functions in reprocity to your invitation to them?

Because they didn't. You are making a statement. If your purpose is to critisize, you may have achieved your target.

Oh c'mon Tom..... u can do better than that ....... the point he is trying to make is - if we are an officially recognised club, shouldnt BMW Malaysia include us in some (not even all-lah) of their activities...... correct me if I am worng, the last do at Hartamas was apparently courtesy of Souled Out (even then i suspect that was becoz we had our do there recently, otherwise forget it dudes!)........ this is what got some of the members into trouble i think....... they openly criticised the fact that the club is so beholden of BMW Malaysia but BMW Malaysia has not returned the favour.....there is simply no reciprocity! Since I have been a member I only remember only the last AGM where they contributed something........... so my question is "When arr, Mr. BMW Malaysia?"....

JPB.... "you were invited for the pre-launch of the E90 at Avenue K, fine! Congrats!! But to arrogantly stuff this at our faces is very unkind. I've been invited for the official launch too but took the trouble to include elwine30 and eldrow by faxing details of their address and tel. no. to Auto Bavaria. Did you do the same for any of us? Yet, you brag in our face?"...... c'mon-lah bro...... that wasnt butoh's point was it? Or am I the only one seeing this?

6. Why do I get invation to BMW official functions, eventhough I m BUToh?

Because you were. Because you are a potential BMW buyer. -That's it

I think this statement by Mr. Butoh was unnecessary. He had made his point already (see para 5 above), so i can only conclude he was having a bit of fun at everyone's expense in this instance a.k.a as JPB said "But to arrogantly stuff this at our faces is very unkind"...... on this note I have to agree with JPB...... see, we CAN agree on some things

I know what some of you are going to say.....soooo longwinded lah this guy, like broken record summore...... but i dont really care anymore ..... IMHO I am merely contributing to the forum/club and I have the forum/club's best interests in mind..... if eveyone feels that I have done nothing but create trouble and I should leave - please say so.

Until that dreaded day cums, I shall comment when i feel a comment is necessary coz .........i feel 'PRETTY DARNED SMART!' ( JPB : "Perhaps, you would have done a better job at defending the "freedom of speech" position since you seem so darn smart!" post date April 12)........sorry ego tokking there

Hi Jipster! By the way, I realise you have not replied my earlier PM to you. I've read your latest rendition and would like to pen my thots which I hope you'll digest as carefully as I've digested yours.

I think I have some insight on the Committee's ordeals cos I used to share the same plight. These ordeals are real. They are time-consuming and involves some recurring personal expenses. In the case of a self-employed person, time = income (and that's why I left). In the case of others, these precious time should be spent with their families or friends after a long hard day's work. Becos these are "real" ordeals, they are justified in surfacing this to members who have become so "demanding" in terms of transparency and coming out with decisions which is perfect in appleasing everybody (which is downright impossible lah - you think they are GOD issit?). Why should they be compelled to conceal it so that you don't have to feel guilty? Most members who have been made aware have shown some gratitude and that is right! They expressed gratitude not becoz they want to appease the Committee or cos the Committee wants to hear such appeasement but becos like me, they are "grateful". (LAST SENTENCE RETRACTED WITH APOLOGIES TO JIPSTER).

I think those who continually criticise the Committee for everything and don't give an ounce of credit for good deeds (of which there are plenty) have done a great dis-service to this Club. Why? Cos without a Committee, there is NO Club. With the present barrage of attacks, the wisest thing to do for the Committee is to quit. The wisest thing for others is to never step into those shoes. Brudder, there's a bigger picture to consider here! Can you imagine at the next AGM, no-one wants to take any positions??? Well, if that happens, I'm afraid you're hugely responsible for such malaise!

The point you made about handling 'colourful' members with "tact and consistency" has been taken onboard after such persistent ramblings by you and others. The Committee has taken steps at some members' advice to create a better avenue for communication. Can we let this matter rest ah?

On where the Club and Forum stands, please be very clear that the Forum is only a part of the Club. It's only a tool for the Club's members to communicate. If you have no intention to join the BMW Club of Malaysia, you do not BELONG here in this forum.

On E90's launch - this matter falls under the purview of Auto Bavaria, which regretably the Club has very little links with. This is also myrrhed by the issue of being "independent" from distributors and service providers. I don't think they like their consumers to have stronger representation which this Club is striving to achieve. I hope that a better relationship is established but I'm realistic enough to acknowledge this takes time!

I don't think I've covered all the issues. It's not my place to. But in conclusion, I think Jipster has placed a wee bit too high an expectation on the Committee. There are failings but this must be seen in a wider context of good and bad things. If expectations are too demanding or unrealistic, they can no longer be "constructive".

NOTE : EARLIER LAST PARA RETRACTED WITH APOLOGIES TO JIPSTER.

 

[Juan Powerblow]

Originally posted by Jipster@Apr 14 2005, 03:24 AM
Ok lah..... since i dun wan to be like fomoco's 5 year old nephew....... I CONCEDE ON ALL POINTS....... there is no longer any issue real or perceived...... please accept my humble apologies.

Oooops! I didn't see this b4 I shot my mouth off.

Jipster - Please take what I said as purely a rebuttal and I could have gotten carried away on some things directed at you. In all honesty, you could have meant well and given some food for thought but I feel the manner ought to be more encouraging. The Committee can rightly feel very discouraged and that will not serve us (as members) any good.

In the end - disagree also can still be friends! Despite our swash-bucklings, I still regard you as such cos you've tried not to get personal and in that respect, you have been a bigger man than me. Thanks!

 

[fomoco]

:nyehehe: :nyehehe:

 

[three28]

WOIIIIIIII GROW UP LAR U ALLL


Haiyooo.... whats the fuss all about lar...

We are having fun after all....

darn .... i already said this is so immature la... why wash dirty linen in public.

I guess Tom as the administrator has answered the questions on his point . I dont see anything wrong in this . Everyone said their point what .

Lets put all this behind .

Whatever grievances on the committe lets thrash it out on a meeting . Then we forget it shake hands get drunk and dance together .

Please ...

We are a BMW family lar ....

CHEERS

 

[Juan Powerblow]

Three28 - In all honesty, there has been some good points brought up by Jipster and the rest (if you take the time to read and understand their posts). These must be constructively "engaged" in this "Dear Committee" channel. Members must be feel to bring up issues of grievances, whatever they may be and where appropriate, the Committee should respond. This is a very "grown-up" thing and in every serious relationship, there's bound to be conflict. How conflict is resolved will reflect whether people are grown-up onot.

The Committee must conduct themselves appropriately here and as their representative here, you kenot just dismiss the issues by saying "grow-up lah", "immature lah", "let's get drunk and dance together lah" etc etc. If certain suggestions by members are unworkable, good reasons must be given. If certain issues must be conceded, don't be afraid to "apologise".

HOWEVER, I value your persistent attempts at cooling matters down! and you can be very successful in your U.N. peackeeping role and I think you tried to do it here but wrong timing lah brudder!! Now it's the time for constructive engagement, not closing or dismissing threads when the kitchen gets hot.

Cheers, bro! If you wanna hentam me, you got my number, k... hehehe!!

 

[Jipster]

Dear Committee,

The objective behind my response above was not meant to be a critique of the Committee or its performance but merely to point out where (I thought) the comments made by Mr. Butoh have been misunderstood.....

Let it be known that the issues I have raised are mainly other peoples issues which I have taken on board when I feel that the response given has been (again to my mind) less than satisfactory. For example, my rants on money - from a personal perspective, I don’t really care that much actually ‘coz I never bought anything from the Club but there were among us who thought there were issues.... so I said something-lah….

AND, if I am held responsible for any potential 'malaise' - you give me too much credit -lah JPB – who am I to have such influence?

I do not constantly criticise the Committee....on the contrary, this I assure you is a recent phenomenon....perhaps never to be repeated again (I hear wild applause in the background  ….dang!)...... I actually count many in the committee as my friends - Kev, Jeff, Alvin, DD, even the elusive Mr. sideways..... (sorry al, I think we were only sort of introduced during Grand TT recently). Granted our encounters have been brief but I am sure you will all agree that I’m a pretty harmless git who bought a less than perfect E30

I stand corrected on the AB E90 launch thing..... but please understand that I used it purely as an illustration ……. it was not meant to be the point of the argument i.e. I did not mean to nit pick; the E90 launch event is not the issue but rather the lack of reciprocity from BMW M’sia........ but then again, I stand corrected here as well, as Albundy put it - ‘Whether BMW Malaysia send us any invitations for events or launchings is irrelevant to the club. It would be nice but if its not done, its fine with many of us’ ……so I guess ok-lah………

I disagree that I have been unduly oppressive..... if I wanted to be, it would not be in this manner. By the way, I think I have adhered to commonly accepted principles of decency, integrity.... and I have been polite to boot ........... I have merely pointed out perceived shortcomings and suggested different approaches etc........ KHS and ILV are not my idols, they are just friends…..acquaintances who I accord common courtesies….

Again please accept my humble apologies…..especially those of the Committee I have become acquainted with in the last year or so – my sifu Kev, my other sifu Fabian, the ever affable Jeff, Mr. Pres DD, my rim and tire supplier Elwine30, the always jovial 328, the ever stylish Mr. Alvin with his monster (which BTW I have never seen….. does it exist ah?), and the elusive mr sideways…… many bows of the deepest variety.


Regards
Jipster

 

[ALBundy]

Off-topic, well we met at the grand TT and I always tell Kevster you look like Jeff Goldblum (scientist from Jurassic Park) hahaha

No worries bout your E30, i also have one which is no better than yours and an appointment with the "doctor" is due this monday for a heart transplant. :nyehehe: :nyehehe:

I am glad that we have finally agree to disagree . I supposed as long as we can have a discussion conducted with civility, it shall not be a problem and I certainly believe that everyone has their own opinions and thoughts on every single matter which is fine with me as well. Whether a certain party accepts the explanation is another matter, sometimes you just can't please everyone. Having said that, we will always strived to improve on our shortcomings and look forward to more constructive criticisms.

Rgds

 

[Juan Powerblow]

Jipster - somethings I said were out-of-line earlier and have edited my post with unreserved apologies to you. If you still wanna hentam me, you got my number, hehe! Thanks!

 

[chaiks]

Hey u all 1 kind 1! Why need to fight for another person crusade? When u can actually stand firm about ur "own" point, stop fighting 4 someone. Say what u wanna say & not using other person point to make a point. Its beginning to look so bad, that its like Engrish lesson on who is better to catch the word bug. (juk ji sed).

Actually ar.. its very simple. If u dun like what u see r, don't see lah? Why still wanna fight 4 something that no 1 can win? But on another hand, there r those who feed on such a thing, ie. conspiracies, UFO, NWO....blah.....blah..... :lazy:

 

[Juan Powerblow]

Chaiks, not fighting-fighting lah (tho I admit can get quite heated even in just a debate!). Nobody's getting killed here. I think a lot of crisis in this world can take some examples from us i.e. not resorting to physical violence, hehe!

Well, all's well ends well - I hope!

 

[Alvin]

Jip

320i exist. Please come to friday TT for a sneak preview or track day. Cheers!

 

[Daredevil]

I think each and everyone of you (with the exception of those who didn't make any sense, you know who you are....hahaahah) have raised some pretty good points. Minus the heart piercing comments which are commonly used to express one's self, the contents are actually quite understandable and should be taken seriously to enhance improvements.

On behalf of my fellow committee members, I can assure you each and every one of us are doing whatever we can to elevate the image of this club. And achievement starts from within. if our club members are happy, automatically the club becomes a breeding ground for valuable members such as yourselves. While I will take each comment constructively and strive for improvement, I will simply ignore those with a touch of accusation.

Everyone has the rights to voice out their opinions as long as there's no personal attacks and all grounds are substantiated with facts.

So great. All's well ends well. We're all humans at the end of the day. Let's forgive and forget the unpleasant issues. If this episode has left an unpleasant taste in some people's mouth, there's always Listerine. Use it and come back. Everybody's valuable to this club! So let's get back to our normal routine of racuning ppl to mod their rides.

This thread will not be deleted so that future members can sense the camaraderie amongst club members. Problems CAN be solved amicably. But the thread will be closed by tmr.

 

[OSFlanker]

Originally posted by Alvin@Apr 14 2005, 03:08 PM
Jip

320i exist. Please come to friday TT for a sneak preview or track day. Cheers!

I concur. It exists just like the giant mekong catfish & stingray. I have also test driven it, but reverse gear only............:unsure:

Still, the reverse gear tapau everyone!


Healthy debate is good as long as things don't become personal. Personal attacks are uncalled for.