Running on a flat RFT

[Schwepps]

I had my first experience of a flat tyre while on the road today. On a city highway, going at about 80kmh, the RFI warning suddenly lit up. Drove to my usual tyre shop but it was closed for the public holiday, so then drove home. Tyre guage showed that my right rear had zero air pressure in it, so I drove on a completely flat RFT! Waaw, I must say RFTs are excellent. Didn't feel anything, no difference in handling, and it doesn't even look underinflated unless you look hard. Best of all, I didn't even have to stop the car! :top:Asking your opinion here guys. I reckon my tyres have 6 - 9 months of safe thread left. I was aiming to replace all 4 to non-RFTs, but now I'm not so sure I want to. So if I replace with RFTs, I would want to eke out max usage from my OEM set. I don't know the cause yet - there's no telltale 'tak-tak-tak' indicating an embedded nail. No visible sidewall damage either. Assuming it's a repairable puncture, should I continue to use the tyre? I know some of you attended the RFT tyre talk by I can't remember which brand. I drove it flat about 30km at 50kmh...within allowed speed and range.Opinions and wisecracks welcome.

 

[David Yong]

You don't really have to continue your journey till getting to a tyre workshop. You can actually pump pressure to the tyres at any petrol station and send your car to a tyre shop to check later when available.

Anyway, previously when I was still on RFT, I had a punctured before with nail in it. Went and perform the patching at one of the workshop in Sunway and everything is fine after then with no problem until the day I changed it to non RFT. And I believe there are quite a few of us who has done patching on their RFT and with no problem with it.

But BMW advises not to patch or repair the RFT. It is better to change the whole RFT tyre.

So.... it's entirely up to you. But by looking at the price of RFT tyres, I would prefer non RFT and I believe tyre puncture situation does not occur so frequent and even if it does, with TPM feature in our car is adequate for us to get to the nearest station to pump pressure or to a nearby tyre shop to repair the puncture.

 

[E46Fanatic]

Its times like these you'll be thankful for the RFT feature :top:. I think the main issue with patching RFTs are the stiff sidewalls which are prone to cracking and damage when remounting. This causes leaks and is considered unsafe.

If you do ever go with RFTs, the Potenza RE050 (our OEM) or Michelin Pilot Sports RFTs are considered good RFT tyres. Both are bloody expensive and cost more to replace instead of non RFTs (with top high perf tyres)+ M Mobility kit.

 

[MSport]

Schwepps, I had 2 puncture experiences (diffeerent times, about 3 months gap between them). Didn't even go to a tyre shop till days later cos it was a long weekend. I just pumped air and drove normally. Got them patched and continued as usual. The only difference with your case and mine was that I loss about 50kPa pressure on the punctured tyre and still had air while you had zero.

I didn't experience any difference though. Changed back to RFT when it was botak. You can check out my post here at the tyre database http://www.bmwclubmalaysia.com/forums/showthread.php?t=25461&page=6

I know 1 RFT can buy 2 non-RFT...... but then...... still love the RFT :love:

 

[glock_8]

I had a punture at 2k km++. The tire was basically very NEW. Had it patched from inside at Lim Tyre TTDI. They are very familiar with RFT tyres. They take out the tyre from the rim without a single scratch. You have a choice either to patch it from outside (this doesn't require taking out the tyre off the rim). But Patching the puncture from inside (unfortunately have to take out tyre off the rim) is better. Now at 8k km running with no problem. BTW, like david said, if the tpms indicator lit up, the least you can do is to pump up the tyre to oem spec and continue till u can get it fix at tyre shop....at least it will reduce the stress on the sidewall and prolong the rft life.

 

[Schwepps]

Well said guys, but I made a discovery about the new digital pumps with integrated air pressure monitors at our petrol stations. If they can't get a reading (ie, you have zero pressure in your tyre) THEY WON'T PUMP AIR!

Anyway it's off to the tyre shop this morning to see what the damage is.

 

[glock_8]

Well said guys, but I made a discovery about the new digital pumps with integrated air pressure monitors at our petrol stations. If they can't get a reading (ie, you have zero pressure in your tyre) THEY WON'T PUMP AIR!

Anyway it's off to the tyre shop this morning to see what the damage is.

That was what i thought too when i had a total flat tyre (on my other vehicle)....the digital meter won;t pump out air....but just read somewhere at the meter, there is a diff method to pump a 0 pressure tyres...i have forgotten how...but it stated there..by the meter....

 

[astroboy]

Well said guys, but I made a discovery about the new digital pumps with integrated air pressure monitors at our petrol stations. If they can't get a reading (ie, you have zero pressure in your tyre) THEY WON'T PUMP AIR! ...

There's 4 buttons on the digital pump.

1. "+"
2. "-"
3. unit change
4. "FLAT"

U need to press the "FLAT" to fill up a flat. I use that button to fill my basketball and bicycle..

 

[Schwepps]

Thanks guys, never knew that. Both pumps I tried has no markings or even proper buttons left on the panel Must check it out.

My tyre guy offered another reason: the valve sinks in so deep in a 0 pressure tyre that it doesn't activate the pump valve. The solution: remove the valve, pump the tyre up, and replace the valve when the air is escaping. Then the valve pops out into the correct position. Problem: who carries a valve remover in their car tool kit?

 

[Schwepps]

Hanyway, the question of using a repaired RFT here is moot. The hole in the thread grove is so big that the rayon/nylon fibres were peeping out. Must have been a big bugger of a screw or whatever. Even a mobility kit would have been useless here.

The thread on my tyres is still 8mm in the fronts and 6mm in the rears, so it'd be a waste to change the set. Also I'm very sold on the safety and convenience of RFTs now. A hole big enough to push a whole screwdriver into it, zero air pressure, and yet the car didn't flinch, and even handled like normal. :top: I drove a total of 50km on it. Fantabulous! I'm replacing the damaged Potenza RE050A.

 

[racheltoh]

Schwepps..if u change the RFT..u need to change 1 or all 4??

 

[Schwepps]

Rachel, there's no difference between RFT and non-RFT tyres when it comes to deciding whether to change one or the whole set. It depends on the condition of the other tyres and your pocket.

In this case I'll just change the damaged rear one or possibly both rears, depending on the price they quote me tomorrow. It would be wasteful to change the front tyres now, as they still have 8mm thread and are in great condition. I would have liked to try a whole set of Michelin or Pirelli RFTs, but changing a whole set at once would probably cost 8 grand...

 

[Juan Powerblow]

I faced this dilemma months ago before changing to non-RFTs cos having encountered a few punctures from nails in my area, I began to appreciate the full benefit of RFTs. I had a few internal patches done at Lim Tayar but what Funj said is correct, the taking out the RFT and putting back in eventually took a toll on the mounting area (the edge where rubber is in contact with the rim) which caused slow leaks. It was quite inconvenient cos that part is irreparable and even the slightest tear can cause a problem. Lim Tayar's solution was simply to brush the tear with some kind of adhesive oil but it took 2-3 rounds of that before the leak was completely contained. Hence, it is so important you go to a tyre shop which knows how to handle RFTs and be very careful with that area.

Anyways, my RE050As had a long and fruitful life albeit having taken a fair bit of bruises from roads shrewn with unfriendly elements from constant construction in Mont Kiara. BUT, having changed no non-RFTs, I felt it was the right choice. The improvement in ride is significant. I guess it would be some time b4 the ride quality and price of RFTs improve to a level to justify the benefit.

The thing tho, the performance of the RE050A to me is superior to my new Goodyear Assymetrical. In the latter, I have to put in a lot of more effort to make rapid lane changes and even then the steering ain't quite precise. On the RE050A, directional changes are a lot more enjoyable, but the hard ride was simply too unpleasant, particularly for my passengers. Yet again, I am running on 18" staggered with M sports suspension.

 

[Schwepps]

Agree that it's a dilemma. I was all set to change to PS2s like Funj, but what I had was a mini-blowout at 80-90kmh. The hole was so big that the air whooshed out audibly when we pumped it up at the shop! Yet, the car didn't even twitch and thereafter was still rock solid, no mushy feeling at the rear at all! :love:

RFTs are uncomfortable, but the comfort of knowing you have that much safety in a blowout situation overides that factor for me. Also, we were coming home from a wedding in our sunday best clothes, and I could just drive straight home. A hole that size on a non-RFT car without a spare would have been a flat-bed job with the family going home in a taxi. Forget the mobility kit.

Bro, I'm now researching RFT's. Looking at the Tire Rack survey, the RE050A is the only RFT that makes it onto the list for Max Performance Summer: http://www.tirerack.com/tires/surveyresults/surveydisplay.jsp?type=MP
Cornering Stability and Dry Traction are actually pretty good, and not far off the Eagle F1 Asymmetric's. Look where Funj's tyres rank...Grrr! :top:

Do you know of any other good RFTs? I like to experiment with tyres and might just go for a slow transition - change both rears first and then both fronts a few months down the road.

 

[Spaceman]

too bad, i just sold all my OEM 161 rims with RE050 RFT tyres months ago...cheap! otherwise you can save lotsa money , they were done 2000km only.

 

[E46Fanatic]

Do you know of any other good RFTs? I like to experiment with tyres and might just go for a slow transition - change both rears first and then both fronts a few months down the road.

The PS2 Zero Pressure (ZP) RFTs are said to be the best RFTs according to E90 Post forummers. Energy has a set which replaced his RE050 RFT and swears by the PS2 RFTs. Not cheap tho Lim Tayar can probably source a set for you, but you'll have to change 2 instead of 1.

 

[Schwepps]

I was thinking PS2 ZPs too! Do a phased transition - rear axle first, and then front axle. It all depends on stock position tomorrow. Sometimes even normal PS2s are out-of-stock and you can only get Precedas. Okay to wait when it's a normal replacement, but not in this case where my car is legless...

 

[E46Fanatic]

You must be really committed on RFTs to stick to it . On the bright side you have experienced its benefit first hand. Many of us go through our RFTs without "enjoying" its benefit (and instead suffer its downsides) till its time for a replacement, and decide its not worth double the cost of top performance tyres.

So far in my 20 years driving experience, I haven't had a catastropic blow out. Not even stranded with a flat on the roadside. But a few nails and slow leaks caught by me being my anal observant self checking on the visual inflate condition of my tyres daily and sensitive ears listening to nails embedded to tyres. I have also had a few close shaves with sharp metal rod like things to large pieces of wood on the highway, to gaping black holes caused by shoddy road maint while I was driving which I had to swerve to avoid impact to the wheel. Such cases are likely to increase the risk of blowouts. Pushing my luck all this time I guess... hehe.

 

[Schwepps]

Yeah bud, most definitely experienced the benefits first hand. I would have lost all air in about 20 seconds with that hole. The car just went on normally! My grown-up kids at the back didn't even know it had happened!

It wasn't a catastrophic blowout by any account, but I've seen the effects of those before. A close friend rolled and wrote-off his 911 on the NS highway because of a blowout. A close friend of my kids crashed head-on to oncoming traffic and was in a coma for 3 months because of a blowout. I've now experienced the safety of RFTs. :love:

 

[Schwepps]

US Dept of Transportation UTQG (Uniform Tire Quality Grade) ratings:

Bridgestone Potenza RE050A RFTs -
Threadwear 140, Traction A, Temperature A

Michelin PS2 ZPs -
Threadwear 220, Traction AA, Temperature A

Double-A traction means the PS2 ZPs are up with the best of the sports performance tyres. A no-brainer why Energy likes them Your next change, E46F?