Lube n Filter Change

[glock_8]

Just a query, if you change oil at 10k km at your own cost, should the SC reset the OBC mileage? Cos I noticed Ingress didn't change the OBC mileage after I changed the oil.

Anyone?

That is great, since u have fork out your own money..let the meter runs and you'll get the next service free at 25k km instead of 35k km:top:

 

[racheltoh]

Glock_8: for the 10k service, if i remember correctly it was 2-3 days. i think 3 days n i got courtesy car. Beside the service, there were some thin lines running across here n there, n i got them repainted for free. also, the SA drove the car from Shah Alam to IA n rock hit the skirting. so he also repainted the part..

Then about 1.5 months later, when the so-called software arrived, i send the car back for 1 day of reprogramming. this time no car, but got chauffeured from office two n flo.

 

[Schwepps]

Schweppes:
Yes I am using Torco SR-1. The label said BMW Long Life. Also recommended by some ppl here.
I believe IA is using Petronas oil and it does not come loose. So if I need to top up with the same oil, means I have to send back to IA for a 1 min pour-job ;p heehhehe

Have you tried buying top-up oil from the spare parts counters at any of the dealers? They're usually situated near the coffee tables.

 

[Schwepps]

So Schweeps, this is semi-synthetic?
What ever it is, the LL-04 on the label did convinced me.. I doubt there's any other lub that comes with this grade in retail pack.. no choice..

astro, I did some research into lube oils a couple of months back and it was very interesting. I know you're a Torco fan, and there are many other fans in this forum, so I'll just lay out the facts for you and you can form your own judgements, ok?

1. Lube oil is classified into Group 1 to 5. G-3 oil is the highest level of hydrocracked mineral oil (refined from crude) and G-4 and G-5 oils are the true synthetics, manufactured at molecular level in chemical plants.

2. Years back, Exxon Mobil sued Castrol for calling G-3 oils as synthetics. They lost the arbitration case, and since then, US blenders can advertise G-3 oils as '100% synthetic'. G-3 oils cannot be called synthetics in Europe.

3. Torco's own product description says "SR-1 is a selective cross blend of highly advanced 100% synthetic base oils..." and "SR-5 utilizes Group IV/V synthetic base oil chemistries..." So only SR-5 is acknowledged to be G-4/5. 'Cross blend' sounds like marketing-speak for a G-3/4 blend. The rest of the world would call that a semi-synthetic.

4. By their own admission in a debate among US blenders, Torco said they're exempt from API testing. For what reason they didn't say. So their compliance to their own API SM standard is not independently tested. So what then of compliance to other countries' standards such as ACEA, BMW LL-04, etc?

5. Torco is not on the BMW approved list of oils. In fact very few US blenders are on the list besides Mobil 1. Even approved Castrols are from Castrol Limited, Jet from ConocoPhilips GmbH, etc, not from their US outfits.

As an aside, Torco SR-5 is a racing oil and is not recommended for street cars. Racing oils have higher-than-approved levels of additives like zinc and liquid-moly to make them more 'slippery', and these additives will destroy your catalytic-converter fast. Race cars do not have cats.

I'm sorry, I didn't retain the URLs of the many things I read, but you can easily Google the subject yourself. Here are a few to kick you off:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motor_oils
Excerpt: The American Petroleum Institute (API) sets minimum performance standards for lubricants. Lubricant base stocks are categorized into five groups by the API. Group I base stocks are composed of fractionally distilled petroleum which is further refined with solvent extraction processes to improve certain properties such as oxidation resistance and to remove wax. Group II base stocks are composed of fractionally distilled petroleum that has been hydrocracked to further refine and purify it. Group III base stocks have similar characteristics to Group II base stocks, except that Group III base stocks have higher viscosity indexes. Group III base stocks are produced by further hydrocracking of Group II base stocks, or of hydroisomerized slack wax, (a byproduct of the dewaxing process). Group IV base stock are polyalphaolefins (PAOs). Group V is a catch-all group for any base stock not described by Groups I to IV. Examples of group V base stocks include polyol esters, polyalkylene glycols (PAG oils), and perfluoropolyalkylethers (PFPAEs). Groups I and II are commonly referred to as mineral oils, group III is typically referred to as synthetic (except in Germany and Japan, where they must not be called synthetic) and Group IV is a synthetic oil. Group V base oils are so diverse that there is no catch-all description.

A good read on mineral vs synthetic oils
http://www.mobil.com/Australia-English/LCW/Audiences/Synthetic_V_Mineral.asp

Beware of marketing-speak in American oils
http://www.twoguysgarage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=7284

 

[astroboy]

Wow! Thanks for the informative write up.. so thinking of finally found a retail pack that comes with BMW-LL04 rating, now all this controversial debates.. why nobody sue them for misrepresentation meh?

Like that have to go to SC to buy those 1L pack top up oil to satisfy my DIY urge loo.. aiseh-man..

What about Q8 leh? any good?

 

[glock_8]

Glock_8: for the 10k service, if i remember correctly it was 2-3 days. i think 3 days n i got courtesy car. Beside the service, there were some thin lines running across here n there, n i got them repainted for free. also, the SA drove the car from Shah Alam to IA n rock hit the skirting. so he also repainted the part..

Then about 1.5 months later, when the so-called software arrived, i send the car back for 1 day of reprogramming. this time no car, but got chauffeured from office two n flo.

cool, my door is dented and the lower part of the front bumper was scuffed after i sent my car to Sapura last time...i'll get them fix it as well then...

 

[Schwepps]

Wow! Thanks for the informative write up.. so thinking of finally found a retail pack that comes with BMW-LL04 rating, now all this controversial debates.. why nobody sue them for misrepresentation meh?

Like that have to go to SC to buy those 1L pack top up oil to satisfy my DIY urge loo.. aiseh-man..

What about Q8 leh? any good?

My pleasure astro! Payback for laughing when you said that the factory first-fill may be a special foaming oil. :wink: I found that it might be true, as some manufacturers feel that the top-end parts may not catch and wear-in properly if a fully-synth is used right away, so they factory-fill with a lower grade mineral oil. I couldn't determine if BMW does this though.

IMO, there's no harm in using a good quality semi-synth, so long as you change oil and filter often, say at 12k intervals. I'm sure Torco SR-1 is good oil, as Torco has a long history and name. It's just that it's better to know the truth about the product you're using , and then make an informed decision. They can't be sued because it's legal to call G-3 oils '100% synthetic' in the US, and by the looks of it in Australia too. But it's not legal in Germany and Japan. Now which countries standards do you want to follow - Germany/Japan or USA/Australia?

Parts counters at all BMW dealers sell BMW Quality LL-01 oil in 1 lit packs for RM95 for top-up and DIY. I believe AB Glenmarie uses Shell Helix Ultra AB instead of Syntium 3000 for service-fill, and if you want Ultra AB, it's RM80 per lit from Merc dealers. BTW, the Helix that's LL-01 compliant is Ultra AB, not plain Ultra.

Q8 Formula Special 0W-30 from Kuwait Petroleum is on the approved list, but I doubt that you can get this off-the-shelf. Maybe you can get Formula Excel, which complies with quite a few manufacturer standards, but not BMW LL.

 

[turbology]

My pleasure astro! Payback for laughing when you said that the factory first-fill may be a special foaming oil. :wink: I found that it might be true, as some manufacturers feel that the top-end parts may not catch and wear-in properly if a fully-synth is used right away, so they factory-fill with a lower grade mineral oil. I couldn't determine if BMW does this though.

This also support the theory of "run as hard as you can when the engine is still new".
It all helps run-in faster, just like using regualr dino oil.
And thanks Schwepps for putting the info together, I won't have explain it any better.
:top:

And for Zinc, it is use as anti-wear addictive, to protect when there is actual metal to metal scuffing. A good long internal engine oil should have .10% to 0.12% of Zinc contain. Is normal, and okay to have it in engine oil.

Cheers

 

[racheltoh]

schwepps: thx. will lookout for it .