Which type of fuel to use?

[Hammer278]

Schweps,

Have read your posts on gasoline before and yes, am aware of BHP's status in the OG industry. Though I'm sure as everyone's aware, the fuel characteristics can defer even from station to station (2 Petronas stations could have very slight difference) am I correct on this?

Reason for me using BHP, my engine is more quiet, very smooth acceleration and has been 'maintaining' my car for over 2 years and caused no problems thus far. Petronas on the other hand, like you said the nation is having a lower grade fuel while the country is making the revenue by providing other countries our premium fuel. Let's not go into where the revenue goes in the end...for fear of turning this into a political thread. But it is another reason why I don't use Petronas and stay away from it. I'm sure Petronas owners aren't going to lose sleep over this post, but knowing I'm not running on their fuel makes ME sleep better at night!

 

[Schwepps]

kerosene is much higher ron and easy to ignite and mostly used by planes..

remember the 'octane' booster sold by tuner called 'after burn' ? it contains kerosene !!

Pussy, this is the first and main misconception. People think that 'higher RON' or 'higher octane' means easier to ignite and therefore more powerful. Higher RON/octane means LESS susceptible to pre-ignition, ie. LESS easy to ignite. And it has no bearing on the calorific value or 'power' of a gasoline.

What higher RON enables is higher compression engines and allows ignition timing to be retarded to the optimum point for ignition in the compression cycle for maximum power output from the engine. In itself, RON92, 95, 97, 98 all have the same 'power' if they are from the same base ULG fuel stock.

 

[Schwepps]

Have read your posts on gasoline before and yes, am aware of BHP's status in the OG industry. Though I'm sure as everyone's aware, the fuel characteristics can defer even from station to station (2 Petronas stations could have very slight difference) am I correct on this?

Yes, because there are variances in the ULG itself and additive doses in each tanker. Also, O&G companies off-take ULG from each other regionally. Don't be surprised if ALL the gasoline you buy in the East Coast comes from the Petronas Kertih terminal. Even Shell.

 

[ALBundy]

What higher RON enables is higher compression engines and allows ignition timing to be retarded to the optimum point for ignition in the compression cycle for maximum power output from the engine. In itself, RON92, 95, 97, 98 all have the same 'power' if they are from the same base ULG fuel stock.

Actually the timing is advanced for the engine to produce more power and torque. :wink:

 

[Schwepps]

Reason for me using BHP, my engine is more quiet, very smooth acceleration and has been 'maintaining' my car for over 2 years and caused no problems thus far. Petronas on the other hand, like you said the nation is having a lower grade fuel while the country is making the revenue by providing other countries our premium fuel. Let's not go into where the revenue goes in the end...for fear of turning this into a political thread. But it is another reason why I don't use Petronas and stay away from it. I'm sure Petronas owners aren't going to lose sleep over this post, but knowing I'm not running on their fuel makes ME sleep better at night!

If BHP works well for you, you should continue to use it. But where do you think BHP gets its base ULG from? If not from the Petronas or Shell terminal at the KVDT (Klang Valley Distribution Terminal), it would have to be imported by shipping tanker and stored in a tank farm. An expensive proposition.

And even then it wouldn't be from a 'BHP refinery'. BHP is Boustead Holdings Petrol. Boustead is a conglomerate in plantations, property, heavy industries, etc, etc. It is not an oil & gas company.

Incidentally, 'imported' gasoline sounds good, but gasoline does go stale (deposits and gums separate out) I would rather not use gasoline that has spent months in transit on the high seas and storage in tanks. Gasoline direct from the Melaka and PD refineries piped to KVDT is fresher.

 

[Schwepps]

Actually the timing is advanced for the engine to produce more power and torque. :wink:

You are correct as usual Al

 

[glock_8]

There are only 5 refineries in the Peninsula: Petronas Kertih, Petronas Melaka 1, Petronas-Conoco Melaka 2 (newest), Shell PD and Esso PD. And Esso PD is the oldest, smallest and least efficient of the 5, and I doubt it's still producing actively. So all the base ULG fuel available here is Petronas and Shell. Unless you think the other brands import their gasoline, where do you think they get their commodity base ULG from? BHP isn't even an Oil & Gas company! All O&G companies off-take from each other worldwide. Here, even Shell will off-take from Petronas when they go on planned maintenance shutdowns of 45 days. Most of the gasoline sold here is from Petronas.

The only difference between the brands is their additive packages, which are dosed in at the point of filling their tankers at the terminals. But even additives are commodities, not made by the O&G companies themselves. They are not magic potions, just chemicals made by companies like BASF, Bayer, Dow, 3M, etc. It's all the same anti-knock, detergent, dye, etc, only in slightly differing quantities. Slightly less anti-knock in the same base ULG gives you RON95, slightly more RON97. Sorry to take away the romance of gasoline, but better that you know the truth right?

Incidentally, for those who think that we are an oil producing nation and therefore our raw material should be at much lower cost, the truth is that the crude oil refined in our refineries for local consumption is imported Middle Eastern heavy sour (high sulphur) Our higher quality light sweet crude is exported to countries with more stringent fuel standards and major chemical industries such as Europe and Japan to maximise the revenue going into the piggy bank. Now perhaps you will understand why until recently we were at Euro 0 fuel standards and only recently at Euro 2. Using our own crude to achieve higher standards will mean less crude to export for higher revenue, so we're using cheaper imported crude at market prices.

this post is a bit misleading as well...the additives are different from one brand to another not just the amount of additive. the design is a proprietary of the third party like basf etc and they are not the same.

 

[astroboy]

Wow! this conversation can continue and never ending..

A recent warranty job at the SC has made my car felt different. More responsive, same tank of fuel, I wonder why?

Which lead me to think .. what's the priority of our ECU's adaptive value settings? to achieve good FC, machinery conservation, or good pickup/speed? One member even teach me to reset the adaptive value from time to time, he does it every day.. :stupid:

I'm sure each petrol perform differently depending on the ECU adaptive value, despite having the same ULG base, the additive would have alter the combustion characteristic of the fuel. Since the ECU adaptive value is constantly being adjusted, the fuel u find nice today, may not be performing the same tomorrow.. its really a peekaboo game if u ask me.

 

[Schwepps]

Ok, if you take a typical anti-knock agent like Toluene, or oxygenate like MTBE (Methyl Tert-Butyl Ether) or vapouriser like Acetone or dye like Solvent Blue 35, how would they be different if produced by BASF, Bayer, Du Pont or Dow? O&G companies choose what package of chemicals they want to use and in what quantities, but the chemicals themselves are commodities, and the choices wouldn't be much different from one company to another. It's mostly BASF's market here BTW.

 

[astroboy]

Which chemical does the "cleansing" le? and which one is the "friction modifier"? Where can I get Toluene? Heard its cheap and any side effect if over dose ka?

 

[mizhan]

Which chemical does the "cleansing" le? and which one is the "friction modifier"? Where can I get Toluene? Heard its cheap and any side effect if over dose ka?

you thinking of adding 2 tablespoons of that stuff into a tankful of RON95 resulting in RON98 ka..?

 

[ALBundy]

you thinking of adding 2 tablespoons of that stuff into a tankful of RON95 resulting in RON98 ka..?

I want RON100!!!! 3 cam sudu boleh?:top:

 

[Schwepps]

Actually, DCAs (Deposit Control Additives) is one additive which is a concoction of polymeric dispersants and carrier solvents. BASF is still the main player in DCAs and there is a Petronas-BASF set-up here.

Enough chemistry talk!

 

[yintk]

Kudos to all sifus' . We learned a lot from all cos all the way along, most of us just fill in as long as it moves n the only feels we had was that it dries up fast on different brand,, of course depending also on how we drive our machine....Cheers..

 

[jazzler]

I've just put a full tank of Ron 95 on my E90 323 today. TBH I don't feel there's any difference with my car after that. Previously I was using exclusively Ron 97. Hope this helps.

 

[Schwepps]

I've never felt any diff between 95, 97 and VPower either, nor think there is any. As you say...TBH.

 

[racheltoh]

what is TBH

 

[pussy]

TBH = To Be Honest

 

[Schwepps]

Oh sorry Rachel, forgot you only know TGIF... :wink:

 

[loafer]

Maybe the newer generation cars work better with different grades of fuel.

My butt dyno tells me there's no noticeable difference but it shows on my mileage. I get lower mileage on RON95 as compared to RON97.