Satria 1.6 vs GTi

[kelvinp]

Originally posted by clockwork+Dec 1 2005, 10:37 PM-->QUOTE (clockwork @ Dec 1 2005, 10:37 PM)

 

[Daniel]

er, how come no one ever mention about tires?

handle better for the lowest cost imho:

1) just lower the car, make sure its hard, forget the shocks
2) get some thicker anti-roll bars
3) get race spec tires.

you WILL notice the difference.

 

[azfaz]

R3

Check this:

http://www.racerallyresearch.com/

http://www.racerallyresearch.com/gen2_r3/gen2_index.html

 

[DingChavez]

Originally posted by Daniel@Dec 3 2005, 11:51 AM
er, how come no one ever mention about tires?

handle better for the lowest cost imho:

1) just lower the car, make sure its hard, forget the shocks
2) get some thicker anti-roll bars
3) get race spec tires.

you WILL notice the difference.

not that simple..... by doing what you suggest, it will only make the car ride worse ie harder suspension but it does not improve handling. the only thing you WILL notice is a sore bum and an aching back....

in fact it worsens handling as now if going thru bumpy roads the tyres wont be in contact with the ground. also when you put rock hard suspension, you will stress the chassis and create more flex, in turn would negate your suspension setting and upset your suspension geometry. in fact lowering the springs only will actually make the roll center higher thus more roll, to counteract this thicker anti roll bars and springs needs to be used, hence extra stress on the chassis

as with the Gti and r3, the chassis is also streghthened to take on the harder suspension and to reduce flex, which in turn, will make the suspension geometry stay and the suspension worked in the optimum setting (as per design).

do improve handling is not simple. it's not only low profile tryres, lowered spring and hard dampers... to think that way means you do not know what you are talking about.....

my 2 kupang dan kerang

 

[Daniel]

your 2 kupang is noted but lets put it into prespective:

1 stock standard satria VS 1 stock standard identical satria WITH the lowered springs, anti-roll bar and race spec tires.

take them both thru a road course, both bumpy and smooth.

now........ which would you vote will come out the winner.

 

[DingChavez]

thank you for noting my kupang. you forgot to notice my kerang

smooth roads... i'd say almost equal, maybe the 'upgraded' one will be slightly in front.

bumpy roads... no challenge, the standard will win hands down.

why???

smooth roads:
the upgraded one can take the corners at slightly higher speed than the stock because of higher grip from the race spec tyres and better traction as the suspension will keep all four tyres in firm contact with the ground but will slightly lose out on acceleration as it is using higher rolling resistance tyres.

bumpy roads:
the upgraded one will have less pliancy and less suspension travel hence the car will break traction as tyres wont be in contact with the ground. less contact means less traction means less corner speed. the stock car can still corner at speed almost equivalent to the smooth roads scenario as the suspension has the travel to keep tyres in contact with the road ie no loss off traction...

and back to the main question... in the first scenario granted the upgraded car will be slightly faster but will it handle better???

does handling means you can corner better, faster only? or does it means that your car corners better and faster while still retaining comfort? the answer lies in your perception of handling....


my 2 kupang and kerang

 

[The Necessary]

I'm moving this to the Chassis tech forum.

 

[ZeNeGeR]

hmmm good handling ? i have a set of evo 2 front low arm + anti roll bar FS.. THis is guarantee good handling if not can return the item.. Price only Rm500 interested pm me will fit in any wira,putra,satria,gti ect ect...

 

[Daniel]

yes i see that your are simply doing the old 'copy and paste' thing.

and yes on theory it does makes sense to a point.

Question:

DO you have any on-hands experience on this? or is it just simply rambling on about what you read in some magazine?

Fact:

I DO have on-hands experience on this topic.

My brother did have a Mazda MX6 a few years ago overseas where it was fitted with super hard custom spring by Kings Springs. Its so hard that even by resting your weight on the quarter panel, the susp would only drop a few milimeters. So hard that no aftermarket anti-roll bar would be required as it simply would not roll.

That car, when driven thru the Adelaide Hills (South Australia) at high speeds, bumps or no bumps would track excellently (maybe it was due to its 4 wheel steer?). When the roads were broken in some parts, the car would just speed thru them, yes bumps were transmitted to the driver but never so overbearing that the tires would lose ground contact to such effect that control was lost.

Only downset was that understeer was prominent in the tight hairpins, but that could be due to the understeering nature of japanese front wheel drive cars.

So by you telling me that a car with hard suspension is only a little faster then a stock car, i totally disagree with you.

You mentioned the maintaining of comfort? well, upgrading to a sports suspension will only make for the lack of comfort, not maintaining it.

And if your going to bring up the description of 'better handling', why not ask the original poster to make the decision on that he means by 'better handling'.

1) Better handling by theory
2) Better handling by fact.

Your move, and keep your 2 kupang and kerang.

 

[fabianyee]

Stiff front suspension will cause understeer. Experienced that when i adjust the rear antiroll bar to soft setting.

 

[The Necessary]

Correction, Fabian, stiff front suspension relative to the rear suspension will cause a more understeery attitude/feel.

 

[DingChavez]

bro Daniel...

I used to do some rallying......... nuff said...

ps, thanks for letting me keep my kupang and kerang.... i just love seafood