BMW Long Life Transmission Oil for M54 engine
- Thread starter funfer_fahrer
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Hi funfer_fahrer,
You're right, rocket science for the local service shops. I went thru 4 auto boxes (reconditioned units) for my e34 2 years ago and they just could not get it right, I gave up after the 4th swap and decided to live with it. It was still jerky and it could not lockup on the 4th gear (it's a 4 speed unit)
Out of curiousity since all this thread started I made enquiries at a rather well known parts importer in PJ and asked for the replacement ATF for the e39 gearbox and they offered Dexron 3. I insisited that this was not the right oil, but they kinda insisted that this is what they use all the time and with no problems. I then asked if they had the "long life" ATF then the reply was " Ohh this is for those who really want to take care of the gearbox"!
Oh and the min qty sold is 20 litres (standard packing) and price is RM1,050.00 for 20 ltr. blue for ZF g'box and if GM g'box then min qty is 25 ltr green. So if you get a quote of anything less than RM500 for an oil change, then something is wrong. For a complete change including oil in the torque converter, the qty required is about 9 lts. BTW Audi uses the same ZF g'box as well and apparently they sell the ATF in 1 ltr packing (I'm checking these guys out)
My oil change cost a lot less than 500 so I'm going in for another change to throw out whatever crap was put in earlier. My g'box is already acting up (jerky), I did get chance to compare with another car and it was alot smoother.
So for those who decide to change, make damn sure it is the right oil.
You're right, rocket science for the local service shops. I went thru 4 auto boxes (reconditioned units) for my e34 2 years ago and they just could not get it right, I gave up after the 4th swap and decided to live with it. It was still jerky and it could not lockup on the 4th gear (it's a 4 speed unit)
Out of curiousity since all this thread started I made enquiries at a rather well known parts importer in PJ and asked for the replacement ATF for the e39 gearbox and they offered Dexron 3. I insisited that this was not the right oil, but they kinda insisted that this is what they use all the time and with no problems. I then asked if they had the "long life" ATF then the reply was " Ohh this is for those who really want to take care of the gearbox"!
Oh and the min qty sold is 20 litres (standard packing) and price is RM1,050.00 for 20 ltr. blue for ZF g'box and if GM g'box then min qty is 25 ltr green. So if you get a quote of anything less than RM500 for an oil change, then something is wrong. For a complete change including oil in the torque converter, the qty required is about 9 lts. BTW Audi uses the same ZF g'box as well and apparently they sell the ATF in 1 ltr packing (I'm checking these guys out)
My oil change cost a lot less than 500 so I'm going in for another change to throw out whatever crap was put in earlier. My g'box is already acting up (jerky), I did get chance to compare with another car and it was alot smoother.
So for those who decide to change, make damn sure it is the right oil.
YellowMellow
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3er said:
Option??? mmm I checked with AB advisor and the said " mana payah tukar minyak gear box" and after that I checked with my friend who work with AB as a mechanic. He said " mana ada minyak boleh tahan lifetime" I'm confused. My ride is SMG it's a manual gearbox and I'll change on coming service. My gearbox oil is not ATF but it's SMG gearbox oil. Dunno which type but they have it....
Hi Yellow Mello,
So long as it is the recommended oil by BMW you shud be safe since you have decided to change it.
side track - BTW e34 and e39 have different requirements, so far i have been talking about e39.
e34 - 4 speed auto are simpler I think since Dexron 3 is the recommended and I suspect stuff like Royal Purple or Red Line may work better since Dexron 3 market demand would be higher and one would do research to cater for the largest market.
So long as it is the recommended oil by BMW you shud be safe since you have decided to change it.
side track - BTW e34 and e39 have different requirements, so far i have been talking about e39.
e34 - 4 speed auto are simpler I think since Dexron 3 is the recommended and I suspect stuff like Royal Purple or Red Line may work better since Dexron 3 market demand would be higher and one would do research to cater for the largest market.
Deat Funfer_Fahrer,
GOOD THINKING AND ACTION! So we now know that it needs to be changed, but I think going on a timed basis may be be subjective (I know, I know this is ZF itself). Time is one of the factors of deterioration of oil but along with that I would think would be the usage (as in mileage) as well. The auto box would last anywhere between 100K km to 250K km before the clutches and seals go kaput, so if you take 10 years to get there then I guess that's the lifetime.
GOOD THINKING AND ACTION! So we now know that it needs to be changed, but I think going on a timed basis may be be subjective (I know, I know this is ZF itself). Time is one of the factors of deterioration of oil but along with that I would think would be the usage (as in mileage) as well. The auto box would last anywhere between 100K km to 250K km before the clutches and seals go kaput, so if you take 10 years to get there then I guess that's the lifetime.
Jerman
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ATF oil Esso or BMW?
This specification runs a fill for life oil, Esso LT71141.
F. Fuhrer,
Now, I'm a little confused. Suddenly, Esso ATF brand came into the picture? I thought all along we are recommended to use Germany made ATF oil?
This specification runs a fill for life oil, Esso LT71141.
F. Fuhrer,
Now, I'm a little confused. Suddenly, Esso ATF brand came into the picture? I thought all along we are recommended to use Germany made ATF oil?
coolaboutlife
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I just changed my ATF after running 6 years solid with a mileage of 130000+ km. There was not much difference in the transmission after changing, still as smooth. The mechanic keep bugging me to change as he did a check and noticed my ATF was as black as charcoal. He mentioned that a new auto transmission only cost RM25,000... After changing, a good load was taken off my shoulder and more confident that it will reduce the chances of me losing RM25,000.
. After changing, a good load was taken off my shoulder and more confident that it will reduce the chances of me losing RM25,000.
azwanb
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Okay. So now after reading this thread am confused. 10 years is the supposed life limit of the ATF. So anything below that age no need to change? Even if need to change, what would be the decision criteria? If I got the three ticks to proceed, where is the best place to go and how much will the whole thing cost for an e39?
bal3056
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Somewhere in the thread it was mentioned 'drain the ATF in a clean container and then reuse it' ... gosh! this BMW engineer must have been paid to write this 'utter' non-sense so that presumably or rather hopefully the trans will fail and BMW can make more money from the jaw-dropping high new transmission prices.
Personally having 35 years experience thrashing the s**t out of auto transmissions, I do not believe what the manual says as the gospel truth, it's only a guide. They are made to say it for marketing reasons and the feedback from public will be more like ...wah! first time lah no need to maintain auto anymore, can last forever, so save money esp the very sensitive BMW trans.
Go to any auto trans specialists around (I am always in contact with them) and they'll tell you horrifying stories of auto failures on MBs and BMWs and even show you what happens inside the box when it fails caused by the apparent lack of regular fluid change. It's frightening, seriously!! Most of the time, it's the heat here that 'kills' the fluid ... then the whole trans.
I was also told that any fluid/oil will in time contaminate (no such thing as contamination-free oil) and it is this contamination that hits to the bone of the electronics in the trans. The contaminants are basically metallic substances/particles that when it clogs around the internal solenoids it short-circuits them and causes trans problems. You can actually see some solenoids burnt due to this reason.
Remember, it's all how you market a product ... and how convincing you are! I believe the BMW engineers are very convincing.
At the end of the day, it is a matter of personal opinion whether to change or not. Personally, I would change the ATF on a regular interval basis.
My 2 cents worth ...
Personally having 35 years experience thrashing the s**t out of auto transmissions, I do not believe what the manual says as the gospel truth, it's only a guide. They are made to say it for marketing reasons and the feedback from public will be more like ...wah! first time lah no need to maintain auto anymore, can last forever, so save money esp the very sensitive BMW trans.
Go to any auto trans specialists around (I am always in contact with them) and they'll tell you horrifying stories of auto failures on MBs and BMWs and even show you what happens inside the box when it fails caused by the apparent lack of regular fluid change. It's frightening, seriously!! Most of the time, it's the heat here that 'kills' the fluid ... then the whole trans.
I was also told that any fluid/oil will in time contaminate (no such thing as contamination-free oil) and it is this contamination that hits to the bone of the electronics in the trans. The contaminants are basically metallic substances/particles that when it clogs around the internal solenoids it short-circuits them and causes trans problems. You can actually see some solenoids burnt due to this reason.
Remember, it's all how you market a product ... and how convincing you are! I believe the BMW engineers are very convincing.
At the end of the day, it is a matter of personal opinion whether to change or not. Personally, I would change the ATF on a regular interval basis.
My 2 cents worth ...
Jerman
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Change or Not to Change?
azwanb,
There are enough of debates on this topic whether to change or not! F. Fahrer will give you a 3-days/2-nights "lectures" NOT TO CHANGE..........
To me, if you are in doubt, just change...........as Kevster puts it Nothing Last Forever!
For E39, it should be about this costing, 6 litres of the Esso LT71141 ATF oil @ RM60/litre. Gasket RM45, Filter RM50 & labour RM50
It's your call, bro
azwanb said:
azwanb,
There are enough of debates on this topic whether to change or not! F. Fahrer will give you a 3-days/2-nights "lectures" NOT TO CHANGE..........
To me, if you are in doubt, just change...........as Kevster puts it Nothing Last Forever!
For E39, it should be about this costing, 6 litres of the Esso LT71141 ATF oil @ RM60/litre. Gasket RM45, Filter RM50 & labour RM50
It's your call, bro
Fireblade
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bal3056 said:
Your info is spot on my friend - having handled numerous cases of a very well renown German automobile which also claims life-long auto transmission oil, this is the reality - the oil does not last a life-time. My advice is to change the oil regularly, at least once every 2 years and more frequent if you do higher mileage. I have also seen quite a number of cases of transmission failure on cars which are not regularly used (low mileage) - I conclude that the oil breaks down due to ageing. Its a lot cheaper to change your transmission oil regularly compared to overhauling a transmission.
