Never trust a mechanic you don't know

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loafer

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Here's a little something which I feel I should share with everyone. I'm pretty sure some of you at some point in your car modding days would have experienced this. It all started some time in May '08, when I saw a post in BMWCM from someone selling a 4 pot Brembo caliper. Since I was new at that time and didn't really know much, I decided to purchase the caliper after much persuasion from the seller. Initially I thought I got it at a bargain but eventually I found out that the same Brembo caliper can be purchased from chop shops at half the price. Of course the Brembo caliper wasn't meant for my E36 and I know that it was possible to make a custom bracket so that it'll work. At that time I didn't know that many people who really modded their cars so I didn't really have anyone to ask. Despite my better judgment, I decided to take the advice of the seller and let his mechanic fabricate the bracket. Here is how my "custom" bracket looked like when it was completed. (Unfortunately it was done else where so I didn't see the whole process and only saw the end product when my caliper and spindle was returned to the workshop. To be honest, even if I had witnessed the whole process I probably wouldn't have known any better if that was the right way or not.)
old1.jpg
* Notice how the bottom hole at the mounting area has been enlarged? This was made so that adjustment could be done when fitting the caliper. It is also possibly one of the few reasons why there were so much vibrations under hard braking. The thin part is only 1mm thick.
old2.jpg
* This is the rear bracket that holds the top part of the caliper to the spindle. I was assured many times that this piece of metal would be able take the forces it would eventually be subjected to.
old3.jpg
nut1.jpg
* To enable the new screws to be locked in place, a nut was fastened on the opposite side of the hole. It was welded into place at only 1 point, which was the top of the nut.
nut2.jpg
* Guess what, the welding cracked after a few months.
bent1.jpg
* This is what happened to the perfectly flat metal bracket holding my caliper to the spindle after almost half a year. Any longer and it would have probably snapped. Perhaps I'm lucky in a way, to have had signs that things weren't right on my brakes which lead to the discovery of all this. If the brakes were to fail during high speed...I might not be around now to tell this story. Feeling things weren't exactly right, with all the vibrations and what not, I decided to seek advice from some other BMW fanatics I've known over the months. So to cut the story short, after all the "Wah crazy ah the fella do bracket like that?", "Want people to die meh?" etc.. I decided to redo the bracket at a tried and tested fabricator. Here is how my new bracket looks like.
new1.jpg
* Notice the L shaped bracket extends into the mounting area of the caliper. This is wedged into place to limit movement of the caliper.
new2.jpg
new3.jpg
new4.jpg
* The mounting hole wasn't enlarged like my old spindle so there is no risk of movement under high load. Both the holes to mount the calipers on the spindle were also threaded so that the screw is bolted directly into it without needing a nut on the opposite end. I've yet to try this new bracket since my mechanic hasn't had time to put everything back together for me. But by looking at how the bracket is made, I can honestly say I am very confident this will last. That's all for now. Hopefully there is a lesson to be learnt for those of you who are reading this. 1. Never trust a mechanic you don't know.2. Always research something properly before doing it.3. Always seek advice! Total damage so far for this is:-1. 1st "custom" bracket - RM370 (May '08 )2. New custom bracket - RM7503. 2 x 2nd hand E36 spindle - RM200 I will forever remember this sentence that was said to me by the mechanic when he was mounting my caliper the first time round... "Don't worry, if anything happen come back and look for me" ....yeah right, assuming I don't crash and die first la... P.S (I guess I'm more disappointed than angry...so no names will be disclosed. Reason why I'm posting this is so that people are more diligent next time when modding their cars. Always do proper research before going ahead with something or you're going to end up like me!!!)
 
Sorry to hear your experience.. and glad you spotted it before any mishaps. This is one reason why I always avoid bracket/mounting fabrication to fit something that's taken out from a different type of car. The other less critical part fabrication which is common among mod-ers are engine or gearbox mounting... its so unoriginal.. not my cup of tea..
 
Yea I know what you mean. It's very very dangerous if done wrongly, like the first mounting that was done for my calipers.

I'm just grateful it didn't fail in one of the many night time spirited drives I do with some of my friends.
 
Count you lucky stars you're safe and it didn't failed while driving.

Another valuable lesson you have missed out
- "Never ever mess with your braking systems without the manufacturer or authorised workshop's inspection."

My advise, do send your car to be checked by BMW eventhough with the new brackets! How sure are you the
metal grade they use can withstand the heat and stress of the braking system???
 
mikeyew;386758 said:
Count you lucky stars you're safe and it didn't failed while driving.

Another valuable lesson you have missed out
- "Never ever mess with your braking systems without the manufacturer or authorised workshop's inspection."

My advise, do send your car to be checked by BMW eventhough with the new brackets! How sure are you the
metal grade they use can withstand the heat and stress of the braking system???

Actually most E36ers who upgrade their brakes to Brembo 4 pot (with the exception of the BBKs) do this the same way. It's the same for E34 as well. Of course the custom brackets shouldn't look like the ones in my first picture. It is my own fault that I had allowed the mechanic to proceed with the installation.

The material was tested in front of me before the fabricator made the new brackets just to show me the difference between the new material and the old. No denying it is leaps and bounds stronger than the old.
 
loafer;386765 said:
Actually most E36ers who upgrade their brakes to Brembo 4 pot (with the exception of the BBKs) do this the same way. It's the same for E34 as well. Of course the custom brackets shouldn't look like the ones in my first picture. It is my own fault that I had allowed the mechanic to proceed with the installation.

The material was tested in front of me before the fabricator made the new brackets just to show me the difference between the new material and the old. No denying it is leaps and bounds stronger than the old.

Bro, just an advise to your refabrication work . Try if possible not to use allen head studs for this application. The braking forces induce a lot of stress into the stud bolts. Try and use the studs that are automotive grade for added safety as they are of higher tensile strength by design compared to allen head bolts.
 
wc9922;386769 said:
Bro, just an advise to your refabrication work . Try if possible not to use allen head studs for this application. The braking forces induce a lot of stress into the stud bolts. Try and use the studs that are automotive grade for added safety as they are of higher tensile strength by design compared to allen head bolts.

Thanks for the pointers bro. I'll make sure to check it out and see if I can find replacement for it.

Just worried that there won't be enough clearance between the studs to allow a wrench to tighten it.
 
Pardon me but why do you need brembos when german tech ori parts can do the job beta than the pasta peeple? Lucky you got away without any injury...you should blacklist the backyard baboon who did the 1st install and hang the pusher!
 
Thank god nothing happen. U should confront the mech to get compensation or at least give him some lecture/lesson.

Where do u got the brembo? What car is it from assuming 2nd hand?
Me thinking of upgrading my brake also but lil put off by reading this.
 
initialM;387247 said:
Thank god nothing happen. U should confront the mech to get compensation or at least give him some lecture/lesson.

Where do u got the brembo? What car is it from assuming 2nd hand?
Me thinking of upgrading my brake also but lil put off by reading this.

i know he get it from who..:listen:
 
Hi loafer, happy 2 know that u found out the shoddy work in time & u r safe & sound. Good that u have highlighted ur case so that others do not suffer the same fate or possibly worse. My brakes were modified using another system. Remember the pics that I show u @ d AGM? Last time I check appx 2 weeks ago, its' still in order. Cheers.
 
udm68;387257 said:
Hi loafer, happy 2 know that u found out the shoddy work in time & u r safe & sound. Good that u have highlighted ur case so that others do not suffer the same fate or possibly worse. My brakes were modified using another system. Remember the pics that I show u @ d AGM? Last time I check appx 2 weeks ago, its' still in order. Cheers.

Yea Hon I remember still. Good to hear that your modifications are holding strong. Remember to have it checked often. I'm definitely going to have mine checked once every few months now.
 
initialM;387247 said:
Thank god nothing happen. U should confront the mech to get compensation or at least give him some lecture/lesson.

Where do u got the brembo? What car is it from assuming 2nd hand?
Me thinking of upgrading my brake also but lil put off by reading this.

Don't need to confront la. Like I said, I don't blame any one but myself for letting this happen. Karma will turn around to bite him in the ass some day. :)

Anyway the Brembo's are actually OEM models made for BMW. They were taken off E38s.

I'm currently on the lookout for Alfa Romeo 4 pot OEM Brembo. Thinking of replacing mine with those cause my current mechanic says very little modification is needed.
 
SarJeePekAi;387051 said:
Pardon me but why do you need brembos when german tech ori parts can do the job beta than the pasta peeple? Lucky you got away without any injury...you should blacklist the backyard baboon who did the 1st install and hang the pusher!

Already blacklisted them sir.

Unfortunately ori is single pot :(. Wanted a little bit more braking power ma...mana tau ended up more headache instead lol.
 
loafer;387263 said:
Unfortunately ori is single pot :(. Wanted a little bit more braking power ma...mana tau ended up more headache instead lol.

Yup I feel ori single pot is not enuff for spirited & aggresive drive for BMW at least for me. Sumore wt auto transmission & heavy body BMW need more distance braking.
BMW should design 2 pots for at least 2.8 cc & above. Do u mind PM me where u got the brembo & how much.
 
hrm, sounds like from a shop in "sunway" :) , experts in E36 apparently :)..
sorry to hear about your bad experience bro , i almost wanted to get that set , but i didnt because i felt it was dodgy, how could something that was only used for a few months look so worn out ?
 
graffika;483585 said:
hrm, sounds like from a shop in "sunway" :) , experts in E36 apparently :)..
sorry to hear about your bad experience bro , i almost wanted to get that set , but i didnt because i felt it was dodgy, how could something that was only used for a few months look so worn out ?

Nope the shop isn't in Sunway. The workshop I do go to is in Sunway though. Which shop are you referring to? There's 2 shops in Sunway that specialize in BMWs and one is relatively new, just opened last year. The workshop I do go to in Sunway has been there for more than 2 years already.

The bracket that holds the caliper to the spindle is very important. It needs to be machined using proper material with the right dimensions. Several of my friends are running the same setup now for years without any issues.

I did go for a number of very spirited drives after having the brakes installed so that should explain why it looks so worn out. If I recall it was about 6 months or so. Maybe less.
 
Loafer you should name the place/ person who did the first fabrication mainly 'cos apperantly he is putting people's lives in jeapordy. What type of a moron welds nuts to hold one of the most important segment of a car which is the brake system.
 
luckly nothing happen bad to u bro.
can i know which workshop is that?
its better to know b4 somebody get hurt.
 
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